In the heat of summer Socrates was walking through the forest. He felt thirsty, and he saw a man sitting on the ground seemingly asleep while sitting up.
Socrates: Excuse me, it’s a hot day and the lake is a far walk, do you have any water to drink?
Buddha: I don’t have any water
Socrates: Oh, I see, well I suppose that I will just have to make the walk, by the way how do you manage to sleep while sitting up.
Buddha: I am not sleeping, I am meditating. It helps me see clearly and end my desire.
Socrates: Meditation you say, what does that have to do with desire?
Buddha: When you let the mind run it jumps from one thing to the next constantly attaching itself to one object and the next. How much does your mind long for a drop of water and how fast will it move on to the next object when this desire is filled?
Socrates: My body needs the water and what control do I have over my appetition?
Buddha: You may have no control over your hunger but the craving that this hunger breeds you may learn to reign in. If you have this conceptual longing, you will suffer. The habit of longing is built by letting your appetite be the master and not the self.Socrates: So, you think desire is what causes suffering?Buddha: Craving, desire, or attachment is the root of all suffering.
Socrates: Then what is craving, desire, and attachment?
Buddha: They are all similar realities, it is okay to enjoy the pleasures of this life but when one longs for these pleasures, then they cause themselves suffering. The desiring of some reality causes suffering and to be at peace with oneself not seeking any different reality than they have they find peace and become enlightened. Ending suffering releases one from samsara, the endless cycle of rebirth and death.
Socrates: It seems clear to you that ending the longing for some end will bring peace and stop suffering, but how does this exactly work?Buddha: Say you desire to be richer. So, you decide to rob a traveller. You surprise them at night and after a short fight you have killed the traveller and stolen their measly possessions. In the fight you get many wounds and they cause you a great deal of pain. You do not appreciate the effort that this money requires to acquire and spend it on luxurious items and intoxicants. You craved something and in fulfilling its end you find more suffering and more craving for and you desire has not ceased. It is endless craving and will lead you to pain while a simple life where you are free from passions one will find themselves in bliss. We see our lives as permanent things that we cling to, power health and relationships all come to an end and when we cling to the permanence of these temporary states, we bring suffering to ourselves.
Socrates: So it is not just that unfulfilled desire causes suffering but that desire itself is the cause of suffering, and if we crave the things to be a certain way that they are not then we suffer. For me I love to discover more about my self and the world. I crave answers to important questions such as what justice is, and what should the government look like. Does my craving the truth cause me suffering?
Buddha: Yes if you crave answers then this will cause you suffering, perhaps there are no answers to these questions, and you are and constantly searching for something that does not existSocrates: So the continual search for truth is something that will cause suffering?
Buddha: Not the search itself but the attachment to finding the answer and the desire for more knowledge, practise self control of the passions and of the mind if you truly want peace.
Socrates: I suppose it is not peace that I am after but an interesting life for myself and the good of those I meet.
Buddha: Would you say that the pursuit of knowledge brings you peace and smothers your suffering?Socrates: I would agree that doing philosophy brings me peace, so is that what I am truly seeking and is philosophy just a means to acquire this peace?
Buddha: That is for you to answer my friend.
Socrates: So then have we come to the opinion that the good life is the one free of suffering? And any act that we do for enjoyment and fulfillment are just trying to get to this suffering to cease, and your position is that the cause of this state of suffering is attachment, desire, and craving.
Buddha: It looks like this conception of the good life is correct. These acts that we perform seem to be attempts and ending suffering. And yes, this is my position on the causes of suffering. Now I would argue that to free from suffering one needs to be a moral person would you agree friend?
Socrates: Yes I believe this to be true
Buddha: I have five moral precepts that will bring peace to your life. They are refrain from killing any breathing thing, refrain from stealing, refrain from sexual misconduct, refrain from telling lies, refrain from intoxicants
Socrates: This is a nice list of morals you have here, we should examine them to see if they are truly what end suffering for the individual and if they are good. The first one is refrain from killing any breathing thing, Now does this include animals?
Buddha: Yes, this does
Socrates: Let's look at the example of the doctor. We would say the doctor who kills their patients would be a bad doctor and the one who saves lives would be a good doctor. The doctor who saves lives will have wealth and friends and be loved, while the doctor who kills their patients would be lonely and sad and be in trouble with the law. Now how does this work when there is somebody attacking you with great force or an incoming army to your city, do you let them kill your people and just passively stand by?
Buddha: You always have the option to run away or bring reason into the one threatening you, violence will only cause destruction and suffering
Socrates: Perhaps we are too quick to resort to violence, I’m still not convinced that we should let Persia conquer Athens and all become slaves.
Buddha: It is your attachment to this city and these people that will bring the downfall of yourself, if you understand the temporality of things you will see that another army will come once that one has been here, and to kill the one who threatens you only invites pain into your life
Socrates: Ok then let us move on to the second moral. There is a just way of attaining what you need for your self and family and there are ways of laziness and greed. Although could you say that a slave who does not own their freedom could steal their own self away from their master if they were to run away, would this be in violation of your precept.
Buddha: The trading of humans is not a legitimate form of property so this would not be stealing
Socrates: Then I think to refrain from stealing is just and good and will lead one to a better life. This third precept you said is to refrain from sexual misconduct, now can you clarify what you mean by this?
Buddha: Sexual desire can cause us a great deal of suffering and harm to others. One must control their urges to refrain from rape, adultery, and sexual relations with minors
Socrates: I see sexual desire as a form of craving that is of the most powerful of attachments, and if your theory is true then it would follow that it leads to the greatest amount of suffering. There are acts of sexual nature that are inappropriate and unjust and I think these are a fair description of them. The fourth precept is to tell the truth. Now is this truly what is justice? I can imagine the truth being much more harmful that a simple lie. Say someone is being charged by the law and they are innocent, the truth puts them on the scene of the crime even though they were not the one committing it. Should they lie and say that they were not there?
Buddha: It is much simpler if you always tell the truth, lying will get you caught in a web that will bring misery. The more you deceive others, the more you deceive yourself. Even if telling the truth will cause you the end of your life you should not speak lies.
Socrates: Perhaps preservation is not as important is the moments of peace we experience. So, the last precept is refraining from alcohol and drugs. Some people lose their selves in drugs and alcohol but a little can bring peace and joy to the self when the burdens of life are heavy
Buddha: Someone wanted to break one precept and so they chose the fifth. And when they did this they went and violated all the other four as well. We need not rely on these external sources for our peace but can cultivate it for ourselves without the recklessness and wrong mindfulness that accompanies it.
Socrates: I do not think this fifth precept is something that I am truly internalizing. Having a drink with friends is a great time, and we speak of philosophy and other interesting topics. I will entertain you in the idea that to be the ideal person to lose rationality in anyway is problematic in trying to be a good person. I am wondering one thing right now. Are we doing these actions because they are the good and they will be beneficial to all people that are affected by your actions, or is it purely out of self interest? Do you prescribe these moral precepts because they are the good or because they are advantageous to the individual?
Buddha: These precepts will allow one to cause less suffering on others, if this is what is good then it is that. Does the reason behind the action truly matter if the outcome is positive? If suffering and death are what morality is based off and these precepts put an end to that, then would they not be what is good?
Socrates: If the good is ending suffering and these prescribed actions end suffering, then how could I not agree that this is what the good is. What do you say we walk to the lake and get a drink of water?
Buddha: Yes I think that is a great idea
Socrates: You seem to have thought a great deal about suffering. You have told me what causes suffering and what to refrain from doing to not bring about suffering on myself and others. But what do you think I can actively do to end my suffering?
Buddha: I have eight things that you must do if you want to end the suffering in your life. They are right understanding, resolve, speech, action, livelihood, effort, mindfulness, and concentration. We have covered aspects of some of these while examining the moral precepts, namely right action, mindfulness, livelihood, and speech.
Socrates: Right understanding makes sense to me; how else would one know what the good is if they do not understand things correctly. And without knowledge of the good they will end up in suffering. Now how can you explain correct resolve?
Buddha: One must harbour the correct emotions towards others, it will not be possible to act with kindness if one holds anger for their fellow man.
Socrates: I think to act in accordance with the good we must act as rational beings free from persuasion from our irrational emotions, perhaps both of our ideas of controlling the emotions are consistent with each other. But moving on, it seems as though speech is related to action but for this exercise lets examine it as if it is its own thing. We have examined the problems of telling lies earlier but this idea seems to be broader than just telling lies. What do you mean by right speech?
Buddha: I mean refrain from speech that is untruthful, divisive, harsh, or gossip
Socrates: While I agree that speech that is untruthful, harsh, or gossip will lead to suffering I don’t see a problem with divisiveness. How else may we find the truth of matters or ask questions that are assumed to be true that have not had proper examination?
Buddha: Divisiveness will lead to conflict.
Socrates: I think doing philosophy may be a painful process, me and my partners explore what is the truth of matters. We must be divisive in this exploration if we are to discover anything.
Buddha: The truth can be delivered in a way that is not devise
Socrates: What kind of truth lacks divisiveness?
Buddha: The truth about the nature of your self is not divisive?
Socrates: as we agreed earlier stealing is not in accordance with the good, but what about a livelihood that causes suffering on others such as a warrior, or a butcher?
Buddha: These positions will bring suffering to oneself and others.
Socrates: I suppose we cannot get around the moral precepts by excuse of profit, what is good is always good. Now what it that you meant by right effort, mindfulness, and concentration?
Buddha: One must not only think in a correct way but must put the effort into attaining this goal. Then they must meditate the mind into to calmness and clear perception to attain correct mindfulness, one does not let the mind constantly attach its self to the many desires and entertain fantasies. Correct concentration entails keeping the mind focused on the correct view or understanding
Socrates: It seems as though much of what you prescribe is a way of interacting with the material world that will release one from suffering. But much of your ethics are a way of thinking about the world. Do you seek to escape from seeing the world in a painful way as to not suffer? Is this not a form of ignorance to delude oneself from the truth to find peace?
Buddha: I prescribe no such thing. If one has an illness and they do not understand what the cause of the illness is, and they are also ignorant of the cure then they will surely suffer. Now if they understand the illness and the cure they will be alleviated from the suffering. I prescribe seeing the world for how it truly is as liberty from the pains of this world.
Socrates: I have to agree that to see the truth is in ones benefit and ignorance is a burden. I was not understanding what it meant to undertake these pursuits, but I can see how they could lead to seeing the truth, you must teach me your techniques for controlling one’s mind. Ah lovely we have arrived at the lake.
Buddha: Indeed, let us drink
Socrates: I have had a wonderful time talking to you, I want to make it back to the city before dark. Take care my friend